Gender Inequality in the Poetry World?

There's much discussion, in the poetry blogosphere, about an article written by Craig Morgan Teicher for Publishers Weekly, called Poetry Off the Books, essentially about the importance/prevalance of poetry blogs and 'zines on the Internet.

I read a lot of poetry blogs and blog comments fields, and listservs, rarely discussing or commenting them, but this latest hot topic takes the biscuit. Firstly, i'm all for feminism, in terms of gender equality, and i consider myself a feminist.

A contributor to the premier issue of Triptych Haiku e-mailed me, giving praise for the issue, and pointing out that there were more men than women included. This person is a lesbian (does that have any relevance?). She was right, there were more men, and i wish i could remember the men:women rejection ratio -- guessing would be pointless, as i received so many submissions, but i think more men submitted. Anyway, I'm not sure what she meant by that, and i don't think it was merely an empty observation.

I'm under no obligation to include women in Triptych Haiku, or men; similarly, Craig is under no obligation to include women in his article -- and neither of us are sexist for not doing so, unless our intentions are malicious and/or sexist. In my case, it would simply be that no women submitted poetry i felt was relevant/well-written enough to publish; in Craig's, i don't think you can start screaming 'gender inequality' with such a short list of 'zines, for only two of which the editor is specified, and three poetry blogs. Three. When i read Anne Boyer's blog about this, i was expecting a list headed 'Top 30 poetry blogs', with no mention of a woman; but there were just three. (Read what Craig had to say of his intentions, on his own blog: http://slickerchumways.blogspot.com/2006/04/hi-everyone.html*.)

Are there more relevant poetry blogs out there, than what was listed? Perhaps; and the argument should be focused thusly, and not made an empty matter of gender. Are people saying that he should have substituted a poetry blog that he felt was less frequented by poets, simply because that blog is written by a woman? That isn't equality at all.

One of the five outlets Craig mentions as having published his poetry, and one of three he has 'some editorial affiliation with', is Octopus Magazine, it then being a path of least resistence to interview one of the editors for the article, who just happens to be male. And just as there were only a mention of three blogs, there were only two editors. Had there been twenty, i'd be burning my bra, too.

On Craig's blog, I didn't read any thoughts to the effect of 'women poets/editors are inferior and their blogs/'zines aren't relevant or important to the poetry blogosphere.' Also, he tried to 'get an interview [with] a woman Web-journal editor, but she did not respond to my queries, and I was on a deadline.' Which makes me wonder why Anne said: 'I was expecting [Craig's] answer to be "I effed up!", not "Women are really not that important in the blogworld" compared to say, Ron and Josh (or in the subtext of his defense -- Jimmy and Zach.) ' Show me where he said that, Anne. Show me. And Shanna Compton said: 'i actually expected his answer to be something like, ... "gee, sorry. i just had my head up my ass & it didn't even occur to me that all i had to do was cursorily mention at least one lady to get all you bitches off my back."' Show me where Craig uses language anything like this anywhere on his blog, Shanna. Show me. That isn't fair, and you're creating a false beast that exists only in your head.

Anne points out that: 'he doesn’t have any women poets on his blog roll – no Mlinko, no Jarnot, no Gordon, no Spahr, no Compton, no Young, no Warren.' No women? Fine. But, why should he have these women listed there?

Anne: 'I do believe, however, there might be a perception shared by a few male readers of blogs that women "do not blog"....' Oh please, Anne, i doubt there is even as small a number of men that think this that can be counted on the 'digits on one or two of [your] hands'. Please. I'd be satansmacked to find anyone thinks this. And if you feel that the number is so small, why mention it at all?

Yes, women were oppressed in society and were written out of history -- I'm all for making corrections and compensating for this, be it gender-inclusive language such as 'humankind', or Reb Livingston's humorous use of the word 'girlcott' (though Christina Hoff Sommers would disagree) -- but, I can't stand it when women cry 'inequality and oppression' for nothing. I think the entire argument is empty and absurd, and i can't believe someone as intelligent as Anne would launch any effort supporting it. One of my two creative writing lecturers -- a woman -- once said: 'All men are womanisers.' And it's this 'we're so victimised' and 'men are evil' attitude that i can't stand. (And is it of relevance that she's divorced?). That comment was so pathetically ridiculous that i didn't even bother negating it -- me, the opinionated debater. And it's these sort of outlandish actions/opinions that lead to outlandish accusations of sexism (not that i [was able to] read what Seth Abramson wrote).

I also read some interesting discourse, here: http://apapoetry.blogspot.com/2006/04/women-poetry-bloggers-speak-up-out.html

Again, we have the ever so knowledgeable Pris Campbell offering her no cents: '...women just aren't up there on the equality ladder yet and I don't know when that's going to happen. Can we imagine a woman for President...' Pris is so unaware of what's going on around her, that i could slap her in the face with a large fish and she would say: 'Oh my, wasn't that a lovely cup of tea'; an opinion much-supported in a previous post of mine. Maybe i perceive women as being so equal to men, that i'm blinded by this alleged inequality? And, there have been many women presidents.

Barbara Jane Reyes said to there being fewer women in poetry 'zines due to fewer women submitting than men: 'yeah, this is totally untrue.' Is Barbara trying to say that women are being purposefully excluded from poetry 'zines, just because they are women? That is such a ridiculous assertion. 'Zines publish poetry, not names -- good ones, at least. I can't speak for other 'zines, but for mine: So far, less than 35 per cent of submissions are from women, and i've rejected more than twice as many men as women. Again, an empty 'we're so victimised' point of view -- and far less submissions from women -- at least as far as my own 'zine is concerned.

Reb: 'Sometimes being a woman and having an opinion is all that's needed to spark outrage. It doesn't even have to be an outrageous opinion.' I'm outraged at your having an opinion, Reb. You should be locked-up. Who the fuck even allowed you to own a blog, anyway? -- Seriously, though, since when was this the case, in this day and age? You're pointing an empty finger at nothing. Maybe i'm wrong; let me know.

Reb: 'I felt uncomfortable [expressing an opinion] too' -- way to enforce the transparent notion that women are frowned at for opening their mouths, and are therefore 'uncomfortable' doing so.

And just when it couldn't sound anymore like a Victimised Women Anonymous meeting, with Lee Herrick offering the consoling shoulder and ear, Julie Carter added: 'My early internet experiences showed me that being outspoken earned me death threats from poetry group hangers on. One guy went so far as to start calling my workplace. I'm dense sometimes, but I can learn from that experience and start to keep my head down.' You better, Julie, those evil men are waving swords at your head; feel victimised no longer and hold your head up, and you'll lose it. . . . I'd be interested to hear the context of this, Julie, and exactly what was said; i mean, were you on a K.K.K. forum, screaming: 'Kill whitey!'?

A post by Shanna Compton: '...of all the nasty personal attacks, anonymous/pseudonymous baiting, blogwars, email flaming, harassment, morally-superior schoolings, outright dismissals, rumormongering, and sexually inappropriate/uncomfortable attention I have felt the brush of, almost all of it was directed my way by men.' Which i'm glad added: '...tho it's not all been necessarily sexist in flavor.' It almost gave the impression that men are out to get women, when most men are simply more inclined to this sort of behaviour, irrespective of what gender the target is.

Holy Satan. . . .

There's most certainly inequality in the poetry publishing world, but it's not gender inequality. Though speaking of sexism and said, i found this interesting: http://wombpoetry.blogspot.com/

26/4/06: *Where there are some good comments: Brenda said:

I am amazed at how many women here are blatantly using the feminist cause as a justification for their disappointment in personally not being included, and therefore not getting publicity from, this article. If we are counting heads here, there were only 2 heads mentioned, and the female head (which would have been a third) did not find the article worth her time to respond. No one wants to blame a woman of course, but if you wanted to be fair, you'd say she, that female blogger who blew off the article, let all of womankind of the blogosphere down. It sounds pretty silly, doesn't it. Are women overlooked? they are in many cases, but it dilutes the feminist struggle to say that in this article, women got the shaft once again. When a masthead has a male/female ratio of 10 to 1, yes, when positions of power are filled only by men, yes, but did any of these female respondents so "tired" and "disappointed" at the lack of female representation bother to look at the masthead of PW? That's right: a female editor-in-chief and deputy editor, executive editor, reviews director, managing editor, and that's only at the top. These "feminist" complainers are not really paying attention to "women", or they would have noticed some of the women involved in this issue of PW. I think they are simply looking for their own names in print, and blaming a man for the absence. I for one am disappointed and tired of selfishness maquerading as feminism. Tired of feminism being coopted to justify individual women's need for self-promotion. Not a single woman complainer picked up the fact that the one annual profile of a poet that PW published is of a woman. That is a wonderful feminist article: a West Coast lesbian to boot. Let's celebrate that for a minute, for the presence of women poets in mainstream publications, instead of saying "you could have tried harder, what a missed opportunity, it's always men men men." I've been a feminist my whole life, and in my definition, feminism is about "women" not about "me". I hear people complain about petty "what about me?" issues, it's not usually about feminism but about sour grapes. Real feminists would celebrate someone like Kay Ryan and blog about her, not try to count how many "female" blogs are on the author's list, implying that there is underrepresentation there as well, which is a lame personal dig.

Seth Abramson said:

Craig,

You deserve better treatment than this. Much of what is happening to you at the moment can be explained by the fact that some people have too much time on their hands, and apparently too little of actual importance to which to bend their attention and efforts.

There is nothing more disheartening than seeing the monotone of selective indignation. Yes, yes, the whole situation is very unjust--and the fact that it is unjust has been militantly called to your attention by some individuals whose nose for injustice only works on alternate Fridays, during solar eclipses, and, oh yes, whenever their personal agendas are implicated.

Sexism, feminism, and poetry have absolutely nothing to do with any of this rigamarole.

Well, that sounded quite a bit harsher than I intended it to. I just feel like I'm watching a train-wreck here--a decent person getting castigated because of what his actions are believed to represent, not because of any presumed or implied (let alone proven) malice. And tilting at this particular windmill (i.e. Craig) does feel to me like a diversion from other larger and more important injustices--including in the poetry community!--which frankly I rarely see addressed by poets on their blogs (let alone non-poetry issues of great moment), in deference to (I suppose) more trivial entertainment such as this, which you'd think we all have more important things to attend to...sexism in our culture is rampant and a vital topic for debate; I just think this is a totally wrong and inappropriate vehicle for that dialogue.